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Field Mouse: [Closed] David Berenbaum who did not write Elf is an ass, so is Gungas

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  1.  
  1.  
    Yes, that's right.
  2.  
    enter comments here
    • CommentAuthormrsthing
    • CommentTimeNov 17th 2009
     
    I'm sorry you're feeling bad, Fan. You got ripped off; you try to move on; then it gets shoved right back in your face again. (I get that about having dropped out of college, so I can sort of relate.)

    You've got some new stuff in the works, right? Stuff no one can steal without getting in trouble? Good for you. Just keep plowing on. If you had one great idea, you'll certainly have another one, and get the recognition you deserve.

    :clap::clap::clap:
    •  
      CommentAuthorgiacoma
    • CommentTimeNov 17th 2009
     
    The bastard! What should one do to trust the others, as Otto would say...
  5.  
    David Berenbaum is also an ass.
  6.  
    Berenbaum can't say I'm a wanna-be writer, because I've been published by a very big publishing company with my novel. I don't think he's ever written a novel.
    He did sound so nice when we talked in the screenwriter's room. I really did believe in him. I guess that's the part that still gets me.

    I think I'll hit the eggnog early this year.
    • CommentAuthormrsthing
    • CommentTimeNov 17th 2009
     
    If people are stealing your work, it must be good. But that's cold comfort.
  8.  
    still angry here
    •  
      CommentAuthorgungasdindin
    • CommentTimeNov 17th 2009 edited
     
    "They Stole My Script!"

    from: LAW OFFICE OF MICHAEL N. COHEN, P.C. | Telephone: (310) 288-4500 | 9025 Wilshire Blvd., Suite 301, Beverly Hills, CA 90211

    Time and again I receive calls from clients that are adamant that their script was surreptitiously stolen from them and manifested into the latest and greatest blockbuster. Usually the story goes like this:

    "I worked for years on my script about ______________ [fill in the blank], and a few years back I submitted it to an acquaintance at [big movie studio]. Then I never heard back from them. My contact at [big movie studio] personally knows [big time producer/director] and I heard that they talk about it but [big time producer/director] said he wasn’t interested. Lo and behold, [big time producer/director] just came out with [blockbuster movie] that just grossed $20 million this weekend. I want to sue!"

    http://www.patentlawip.com/stolenscript.html
    Advantages of Copyright Registration

    The copyright owner should register a work in a timely manner for the following reasons. First, in the United States copyright registration is a prerequisite for bringing a copyright infringement lawsuit. A copyright owner cannot proceed with a copyright infringement lawsuit unless the work has been registered.

    http://www.publaw.com/advantage.html

    These article are not intended as a substitute for legal advice. The specific facts that apply to your matter may make the outcome different than would be anticipated by you. You should consult with an attorney familiar with the issues and the laws.


    If I were you, I would move on. The amount of grief this episode is costing you is enormous.

    SO WHAT'S DRIVING YOU?!!!
    "I still had my hero in my life, my dad, and my dad bought me a book about writing, about being a very great writer. He thought that was my path. Then he died shortly after."

    My suggestion would be to write a script that revolves around a daughter trying to meet the expectations of her father, even after he's passed away.

    There are valuable, free articles on this site that help you get motivated.

    THE SCREENWRITER'S COLUMN

    Linda Cowgill
    http://www.plotsinc.com/sitenew/column.html

  10.  
    Fanny it's awful, what they've done. I commend you for your attitude, I think you're absolutely right in outdoing yourself instead of being bitter or remorseful. Writing makes you happy, so these setbacks should be meaningless in the long run. Nevertheless, it's really really annoying to have it shoved in your face like this, so take all the time you want to be sad/mad. We as humans are allowed.

    And in a more personal note, I'd absolutely love to read anything of your writing, only from my impression of you in this forum. You still have a great future in it, I just know it. The love of the practice really shows in your work, and it makes your talent shine through.
    •  
      CommentAuthorcassbtt
    • CommentTimeNov 18th 2009
     
    Hi folks, let me add that "it ain't over till it's over."

    Sure, you can move on and try to forget it (but it's really hard to do), or you can let it eat you up (which means they won, so don't do it), or you just give it up (which means they won, so don't do it), or you can use it to focus.

    Focus on doing more and better. Learn the lessons, as there will be some.

    But my personal biggest solution (and it's not always easy to get around to recognizing this, when you're feeling in the dumps) is to strive to "win the final round", because that's all anyone remembers, or at least "win the next round".

    As with any good story, Act I is the introduction, and these types of setbacks are just Act II. The more bitter, the better.

    As you know it's Act III that counts and if you finish up right then you can look back on Act II and feel a lot better.

    Oh, it's important to distract yourself along the way, and live a little life "outside" your project. And when you're really "into" your own work that can be the hardest thing to do. But you have to.

    Deep inside, I often use J.K. Rowling as my role model. Like her, I've sat many an hour, unrecognized, unappreciated, in a coffee shop scribbling and scheming away, rocking my baby in it's carriage.

    Well, actually, I didn't have the baby in a carriage part, but I did have the coffee shop thing going. So it looks like that marvellous analogy is a lot closer to MsFannytwinkle-Butt's journey, if you ask me.

    There definitely are problems and roadblocks in this journey, but look at it this way: So long as the imagination doesn't fail you, you're doing okay. Pity the mind that can't come up with anything to write, or the person who writes lots but has nothing useful or interesting to say, or the person who writes for a living but hates writing.

    Now "those" would be terrible predicaments to be in!
  12.  
    whatever gungas
  13.  
    Gungas, honestly, I don't find anything constructive or beneficial in your post. In fact, you may have just been trying to help, but it comes off very mean-spirited.
    •  
      CommentAuthorLozzykinz
    • CommentTimeNov 18th 2009
     
    That David sounds like a right ARSE!

    Can we please kill him?

    Or at least drown him in whipped cream?
    • CommentAuthormrsthing
    • CommentTimeNov 18th 2009
     
    I have to agree with Possum, Gungas. Just give Fanny the integrity of her own pain. You're not her, and you don't know what it's like for her.
    •  
      CommentAuthorLozzykinz
    • CommentTimeNov 18th 2009
     
    FIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIGHT!
    • CommentAuthormrsthing
    • CommentTimeNov 18th 2009
     
    Gently opinionated reproof, with a bit of whiny annoyance--that's all it is. I still like Gungas and appreciate his presence on this forum.:bigsmile:
    •  
      CommentAuthorLozzykinz
    • CommentTimeNov 18th 2009
     
    Me too.
  19.  
    Gungas edited it. What he first had was a link for me to visit for people who have problems because they didn't live up to their parents' expectations.

    Yes it was very mean-spirited and uncalled for, especially considering the kind of man my father was, and how he was such a positive role-model in my life and is so badly missed by all of us in my family.

    I guess you perceive me to be a weak person, Gungas, but I most certainly am not. I am a very sensitive person, but my strength is something other people can testify. I just had way too much on my plate, and I don't know if you could have gone through it, actually.

    Can I tell you about my dad? He stood up to one of the most infamous KKK families in the history of Mississippi. My dad spoke in U.S. Congress on another issue, and my dad always taught us to respect all people, no matter their status, their race, their walk of life. My dad taught me that the truth is so very important, and that there's not enough money in this world worth lying for, and my dad was always there for all of us.

    So let me ask you, if I never speak up about it, doesn't David Berenbaum win? Yes.
    If you knew how rough my life has been, and what I've been through, and what my family went through, you would understand how robbed I felt on this issue.

    I'm going to stick with the truth. I realize this forum isn't the place to put that battle. But I considered some of you friends and I had this stupid thing where I thought, okay, I'll just tell John Cleese about this!

    So I'm stupid.

    I'm sorry I get upset and I"m sorry I get attached to my work.

    If you'd like, Gungas, I can download some things and give you Exhibit A, B, and C, and you tell me, do you think I'm whining undeservedly?

    What if I took your photowork in here and published a book with it, and called it my work? Wouldn't that be fun for you? Would you maybe understand?

    I like you, too, Gungas, but you were too harsh and you were mean-spirited, but even though you edited it to remove the worst offensive part that you wrote to me, I still feel what you wrote.

    I didn't deserve that, and my dad's reputation didn't deserve that.
    My memory of my dad and my relationship with him is one of the few good memories I have in my life.

    You don't know me. You didn't know him. The psychological slant you put on it was mean and cruel. Unnecessary.


    I'll give you some things to ponder. As soon as I download and put them in photobucket.
  20.  
    But I still like you Gungas, but not as much as I used to.
  21.  
    Thank you, Lozzy and Naughty.

    Mrs thing, I didn't deserve the reproof.
  22.  
    Gungas, I spent the last hour or so pulling out letters from editors and other authors, and I also have a letter from Disney,proving I had stuff down there back then, and I have my original Elf as was sent somewhere else BEFORE Elf came out as a movie.

    I was going to scan those letters and that stuff, for you to see. However, as I looked at it, those letters, all of them, are personal letters from editors who took the time to be encouraging to me. They didn't have to do that. The letters refer to different works and different types of writing that I did.

    But I am thankful for those letters and the kindness and the encouragement. There are many good people in the business. I decided not to share my copies of my letters with you, mainly because I do not want to expose that person or their address or my real name and my address.

    So you can chose to believe me, or you can chose not to -- doesn't really matter.
    But I did take the highlights from some of their letters, and here they are for you. I am giving you the publishing house or company, but not the name of the editor involved. I value those letters. I value those people.

    But read their comments and tell me that I could not be the person who wrote the original treatment for Elf?

    literary short stories:

    Fiction International, San Diego State Univ,
    "all of them to be strong pieces" "please try us again. We liked a number of things about these stories and would like to see other samples of your work."

    Cutbank, University of Montana: "I'd like to tell you again how much I enjoy reading your stories. They really are of very high quality. What I like, and also find surprising, is that each has a style quite its own. Another graduate student acted as a reader for Cutbank this past summer. Out of a batch of about forty sotires, yours were the only ones she liked, and she liked them a lot."

    The Georgia Review: "We thought "The last Train Ride" to be a powerful piece of writing, and we hope to hear from you again."
    Peactree Publishers editor

    "Because several of our readers had favorable responses to your work, we wanted to give it thorough consideration. Due to certain marketing realities, Peachtree is taking on very little fiction at present. However, if your manuscript is still available in a year or two, we welcme you to resubmit it."

    Oxford American: "Liked your story but it is too short for us to use. Would like for you to send more."

    Novels:
    Doubleday editor, "I think you have a touching love story with an unusual historical setting...it has been a real pleasure working with you over the last year. I continue to believe that you have that special "something" in your writing voice that can only lead to success, as long as you perservere. I wish you the very best of uck and hope someday you'll send me an autographed copy of your published work! You're one of a kind!

    Random House editor: I'm afraid I'll have to pass. What you've done here is very accomplished. However, after much review, I feel that I am not the right editor for this work. I'm sure another editor will feel differently."

    Harper & Row " "we liked some of the imaginative fantasy elements"

    MacMillan Publishing editor:
    "There is still so much that I like about this novel. And, I am still especially taken with the uniqueness of the story and the power of your imagination."

    Doubleday editor: "There is no doubt that you are a very talented writer. There is a gutsy, earthy feel to your work, a palable sensuous quality that is very appealing."

    Articles:

    Writer's Digest editor:
    "Found the hungry dog story i a pile of stuff on my desk at home. Apologies for holding it for an entire season. Still a funny piece, but there really isn't a place for it in the Digest. At any rate, keep plugging away, and feel free to bombard our mailboxes."

    Commercial fiction:

    Redbook editor : writes vividly and with style. would love to read more.
    Cosmopolitan: can't find that letter, was positive, though
    McCall's: can't find that letter, either, but encouraging and would like to read more of my work

    somewhere are letters from different publishers that discuss my sense of humor and wit in the stories. heck if I know where those letters are, and where my humor and wit went.

    ----
    There's tons more than this. I'd quit writing, get myself built back up, try again, and something else would happen in my life where I simply could not afford the postage to send anything out, and I'd quit gain.

    But if you go through most of my files, you'll see the number one comment from editors is about my imagation and the uniqueness of my work.

    I don't mean that as a pat on the back to me. I think it happens simply because I am first of all, dyslexic. Secondly, I'm creative in a lot of ways, and sadly, lack profoundly in logic. Third, I totally love music, books, and movies.
  23.  
    While searching for my various correspodance files, I came across something that gave me a sudden, clear inspiration for a new work, something I never finished.
    So this was actually, a very productive angry moment.

    It turned out really good, because I now have a positive goal to get over this instead of negative frustration.
    • CommentAuthormrsthing
    • CommentTimeNov 19th 2009 edited
     
    re: "Mrs thing, I didn't deserve the reproof."

    It was intended for Gungas. I also thought his (now edited) comments were out of line. But I still like him. We're all entitled to our opinions, and we're all entitled to disagree.
  25.  
    While searching for my various correspodance files, I came across something that gave me a sudden,
    clear inspiration for a new work, something I never finished.
    So this was actually, a very productive angry moment.

    It turned out really good, because I now have a positive goal to get over this instead of negative frustration.

    That's really, really wonderful Fanny.
    •  
      CommentAuthorenglishcad
    • CommentTimeNov 19th 2009
     
    Fanny Cad is going to the states as you know for meetings, and will be at the Disney studio... He will find this David Berenbaum and he will give him a wedgie (cad is not what everyone imagines) the like of which has never been seen before. Leave him hanging from a coat hook with a sign around his neck 'That's for Elf you cunt!'


    Firm but fare...
    •  
      CommentAuthorLozzykinz
    • CommentTimeNov 19th 2009
     
    Yeah! Go Cad!
    • CommentAuthormrsthing
    • CommentTimeNov 19th 2009
     
    Are you really coming to the US, Cad?
  29.  
    Cad, the idea is terrific, but what if it's someone else's underwear that he's stolen and is wearing?

    Also, too, he didn't stay long at Disney studios. He didn't "do" Elf for Disney.
    He just happened to "come up with that Elf idea" as he was going to Disney for an internship in their screenwriter program. He had told me he had a cousin that already worked there and so he got some help in being "picked" for that position but nobody was supposed to know his cousin worked there because you can't have relatives win in Disney sponsored screenwriting residency competition.

    He handed "his" Elf idea over to Jon Favre, who actually wrote the script you see on film. Favre made the comment in an interview that it was a very loose film treatment that David gave him.

    I guess so. It's all I gave David in the screenwriter's chatroom of Coppola's website for aspiring screenwriter's, directors, actors, etc. I don't blame them for what happened, but I will say when I contacted them to tell them about it, but that I did not blame them, they sent an ugly message back to me. Lowered my estimation of their website considerably, but not of their reputation or their films, and my son-in-law starred in one a short film directed by one of the Coppola's. So I don't hold any ill well there whatsoever. I think the concept of their website was magnificent. I'm sorry I was so stupid as to trust someone in there, is all.

    While on the Coppola's for a moment here, my god, I think Dracula was the most moving, frightening, emotional Dracula ever. Love that movie, despite how scary it is.

    Back to David Berenbaum. What he did for Disney was "Haunted House" , the not so good script that critics began printing reviews asking, is this the same creative, innovative voice that gave us Elf?????

    Also, too, an interview with David Berenbaum about Elf, they asked him, how did a Jewish guy get inspired to write a Christmas movie? He gave a not so convincing answer, in my opinion.

    But how did I happen to write it? I have written a lot of children's stories that use Elves and Fairies. I also am related to Clement Moore of Night Before Christmas fame through my great-great-grandmother Lydia Moore. Also, I am kin to Walt Disney. My grandfather and Walt would be sixth or seventh cousins? Something like that. I have the lines. I just can't remember the number. I also love Christmas very much. I also, to be honest, believe in fairies and elves, somewhat, or want to not be proved wrong. Celtic influence in my life from my mother's side of the family.

    Anyway, Haunted House pulled in money because it's Disney, but it really was not very good, and his script got panned. I don't hate the man, but I really wish he'd admit what he did on Elf.

    Now, my youngest daughter's dream is to be an animator for Disney. But her favorite influences are the ones who went on to form Pixar. Every year for her storyboard for school, she did a board about a book based on a Pixar movie.
    Spirit was her fvorite movie, and mine, too, along with Brother Bear. My daughter I believe, has that genetic makeup that runs through the art families we are related to, and there's quite a few. She's still very young, not out of high school yet, and she's already being commissioned to do art for businesses.

    I do have a script that I just finished that would have been a perfect Disney flick, for all ages, probably a PG rating, and it's registered. It needs revising, so although I lost heart when reading about the Elf being made into a musical, now I feel really better, especially because of Cad's offer of the wedgie.

    Who knows, maybe one day, Disney will do a script of mine that ends up being a bigger seller than Berenbaum's Haunted House. Sweet justice.
  30.  
    Thanks, Mrsthing for explaining. I thought you meant the reproof was meant for me.
    Sorry.
    • CommentAuthormrsthing
    • CommentTimeNov 20th 2009
     
    Don't piss off the faeries!

    Miss Thing got reading some books when she was young that had more traditional English and Irish faerie folklore in them, and they're nasty pieces of work! Might be nice, more likely they'll be mean and scary and do something bad. There's a nasty mean fairy in "Jonathan Strange and Mr. Norrell", which is a great book, imho.
  32.  
    I love the old faerie stories. Absolutely love those. Yes, there are some bad ones.

    I also hope no one misconstrued what I said with the question about Berenbaum being Jewish and writing a Christmas story. Good friends of mine are Jewish, and one part of their family does the commercialized Christmas with Santa etc., and the other part of their family does not. The writer who interviewed David Berenbaum asked that question, about why he would write a Christmas story, considering that he was Jewish, and what the writer meant, was not essentially because of his faith, but because this was the first big work appearing with David B.'s name, and it seemed odd his first big work would be on the subject of Christmas. I believe he answered that his family observes the commercial Christmas. Or that he watched people observe commercial Christmas. Don't really remember. I copied the interview and have it somewhere.
    • CommentAuthormrsthing
    • CommentTimeNov 20th 2009 edited
     
    Most of the Jewish kids I grew up with celebrated secular Christmas as well as Hanukkah. They loved this, because it meant MORE PRESENTS! One family even had a Christmas tree, which they jokingly referred to as their "Hanukkah bush", but they didn't put any religious-themed ornaments on it.
    •  
      CommentAuthorgungasdindin
    • CommentTimeNov 20th 2009 edited
     
    RE: MsFannytwinkle-Butt

    ...how did a Jewish guy get inspired to write a Christmas movie? He gave a not so convincing answer, in my opinion.

    Plenty of Jewish people have written Christmas carols. That's just a plain racist statement. Is this the real MsFannytwinkle-Butt coming to the fore?

    "White Christmas" - Irving (Jewish) Berlin.

    I'm sorry if this sounds insensitive but these are the kinds of things that get brought out should you decide to go forward with litigation. Now, concerning the fact that Cad has been co-opted to strong arm Mr. David Berenbaum, or at the very least, 'give him a wedgie'. I thought it prudent to do some research in order to stave off what might become a matter of criminal investigation; an assault charge against Mr. englishcad.

    Please view the following:



    'Elf' Conscious

    "Singer files $1 million copyright suit over ''Elf.'' Gunnar Madsen, founder of The Bobs, says the filmmakers behind the Will Ferrell comedy lifted his screenplay"

    http://www.gunnarmadsen.com/cat-bin/board/show?end_date=%2B1y&start_date=2004-01-01&summary=year&tid=11&topic_id=198

    Why would Gunnar sue New Line Cinema? Isn't that elfish?

    "You all know I'm a creative guy, got all my fingers in all sorts of pies all the time. One of the projects nearest to my heart was a screenplay about a guy named Elf, who outgrows his co-elves at the North Pole and goes south to New York to try and fit in there as a human. I worked on it (with a partner) for 9 years. Imagine our surprise when they made a movie out of it - without telling us! I am thankful that our legal system still allows mere people like us to sue major corporations, 'cause it's our only recourse. What they done is criminal (or, technically, civil), and I hope that some sort of justice will prevail. Meanwhile, I take some satisfaction from the fact that we wrote one of the biggest hit movies of 2003!"

    http://www.gunnarmadsen.com/cat-bin/board/show?end_date=%2B1y&start_date=2004-01-01&summary=year&tid=11&topic_id=198



    Now, MsFannytwinkle-Butt, If indeed you are Gunner Madsen, why are you impersonating a woman?

    And if you're not, well.....OMG!!! This is getting funnier than 'It's a Mad Mad Mad Mad World' or 'The Magic Christian'.

  35.  
    No, I am not that guy. I am a woman.

    Secondly, I didn't make the comment about why did a Jewish guy write a Christmas screenplay -- I POINTED OUT TO YOU THAT A MAGAZINE INTERVIEWER ASKED HIM THAT QUESTION IN AN INTERVIEW>

    Thirdly, I don't know if the other guys spoke to David Berenbaum or not, but I certainly did and he gave me his name, spelled it for me, gave me the name of his friend who was acting as a sort of agent for him, told me he was headed to Disney's screenwriter residency program because his cousin who worked for Disney helped him get that spot although no one was supposed to know he had a cousin who worked there because he would be inelgible to apply.

    Fourth, I have proof, of what happened and what I wrote, and I'm not going to tip anyone off with what all I do have.

    Fifth, maybe it's funny to you, but it's not to me. I had direct contact with David Berenbaum. I also had given a portion of the screen treatment to yet another person, and I hope they don't turn out to be connected to the Gunner group.

    Sixth, so sorry I brought this up in here to assholes like you.
    I'm so out of here.

    Just leave me alone. You're nothing but a mean snake in the grass, and for all I know, you probably did the gunner website. whatever.

    I know what happened and God knows what happened, and some editors out there knows what happened, too.

    I'm so sorry I ever came in here.

    Please respond so I'll know you've read this. So I may erase it after your sorry, sarcastic ass gets through reading it. It took me so long to get over what happened to me. It's hard to fight back when so many things go against you. But what would you know, you in your photoshop bubble.

    And don't accuse me of being a racist, because I am not. Anyone and everyone who truly knows me, knows that one thing about me. Not only is my family biracial, but I have spent many days with my Jewish friends, as well as friends of all types.

    However, I can accuse you of being a sarcastic, mean-spirited, arrogant ass.

    I believe the underwear fits. (other than shoe fits. I realize you half-way read things.)
    •  
      CommentAuthorLozzykinz
    • CommentTimeNov 20th 2009
     
    Fanny, don't go!!! I love you!!!
    •  
      CommentAuthorenglishcad
    • CommentTimeNov 20th 2009
     
    Cad loves fanny also... I say Cads not helping is he??
  38.  
    Is this thread the cause of the scandal? I read it though not entirely and not after Gungas edited his last post. I don't know how the showbusiness world goes, moreover I can't speak English very well so I didn't dare to write. I can't utter a word but I'd be very sorry if you leave, Fanny.
    •  
      CommentAuthorgungasdindin
    • CommentTimeNov 21st 2009 edited
     
    Gees it's hard for me to get emotionally involved in your claim that 'Elf' was stolen from you when this Madsen guy says he was working on it for 9 years and it was stolen from him.

    Furthermore, Mrs. Fannytwinkle-butt, you can't go around on forums wantonly posting libelous material unless you are willing to back it up in a court of law. This is what we call 'living in the adult world'.

    "David Berenbaum who did not write Elf is an ass, so is Gungas"

    Defamation and Slander on the Internet

    Blogs or social networks in which defamatory statements are written or recorded present several potential sources of liability and recovery for the person whose character was defamed. In cases where the defamation is proved, damages are presumed and often enforced with liberality.

    Another potential source of liability is the person who actually posted the defamatory materials. As with more general defamatory statements or materials, a poster can be held personally liable for anything posted which reflects falsely and negatively on a living person’s reputation.

    Posting false and explicit claims regarding a person will generally be held as defamatory for purposes of liability.

    http://ezinearticles.com/?Defamation-and-Slander-on-the-Internet&id=422889

    •  
      CommentAuthorDean
    • CommentTimeNov 21st 2009
     
    I have only one recourse if people don't play fair, which is banning, and although this is harsh, I will do it unless people are fair and reasonable. This applies to everyone, however nice they might be sometimes.

    You have been warned.
 

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